software and waste

[El_Cu_Guy]

First off I want to make you aware that the following concerns packaged software. While there will be a number of you that proclaim that all your software/music is purchased or freely gotten from the internet, I would like to voice my opinion.

I checked the mail today and found two CDs. One for AOL and another for Netscape (the ISP). The AOL CD was cased in an elegant package made of about 50 different materials while the Netscape CD was in a simple black case about the size of a CD case but made of the cheaper and all around better DVD case material.

It got me to thinking. Even though software distributors have done much to reduce material waste (mostly from a cost standpoint) but they still need to do more. While the cardboard boxeas they use have gotten smaller, many still use the clear brittle plastic CD cases.

I seriously believe that they should use these smaller DVD style cases (2/3 the size, just large enough to hold the CD). Most software comes with oversized manuals that don't fit into the cases anyway so why use them?

An article I was reading in a waiting room in POC World about how companies are trying to be environmentally friendly (HP PC recycling and such) along with the fact that it just makes sense.

In a perfect world:
Lower materials cost means you can charge just as much and make a bigger profit thus more money for investors and hopefully employees too.

So tell me what you think and maybe we can get enough people talking about this to make it happen. Beside if GNU/Linux distributors were to be among the first to start this it would be great PR.

Disclaimer: I am NOT a tree huggy hippy. Although I did have long hair for a number of years, praise gas/electric hybrid vehicle manufacturers, and think solar power is a great option (those rain canopies at gas stations and car rental places would be great for commercial installations), I DO NOT HUG TREES!!!

[duncanbojangles]

What you are saying makes sense ... in a perfect world. In a perfect world, people make up their minds based on the quality of a product, not its packaging and pretty colors. The same is not true in the real world. Vendors need large software boxes so they can show you all the "features" and reviews of their software.

I remember when computer game distributors switched to the smaller boxes that were about the size of a paper back book, and all I could think was, "Wow. That looks cheap." I'll admit, sometimes I have based my purchasing decisions on a product's packaging. But it is also true that sometimes you can tell the quality of a product by its appearance. If you read the reviews and they read like engrish, you probably wouldn't buy it.

AOL is a major contributor to waste. It was reasonable when they packaged their CD's with shrink wrap and cardboard backs, but now they are being sent out in tin cans and extremely large cardboard boxes.

I find that the music industry can't really change their packaging much because

1) the CD's aren't getting any smaller.
2) There still needs to be space left for song titles and album art.
3) The currently used CD cases are a good tradeoff between price and size. Noone wants 100 DVD cases when slimmer CD cases will do. DVD cases take up quite a bit of room.

Finally, is this a big enough concern to be worried about? Shouldn't you be able to recycle old CD cases at electronics and music stores in a free and convenient way? Shouldn't we be more worried about the waste AOL creates just making their CD's and batch mailing them? Thinner boxes used to package software might be an alternative: the distributors still have ad space but it uses less materials.

[Alex Cavnar, aka alc6379]

I'm down with software, personally. I like my Music CDs the way they are.

Personally, I do like the way game publishers of recent times have made the boxes smaller, going from the size of a cereal box to the size of several TV Guide magazines stacked together. Since I generally throw the boxes away, and stick the media in a binder, I would even prefer slimmer packaging.

Now, I'll tell you what gets me, though. I've got a Dell Axim, and I bought a Secure Digital memory card. Keep in mind, these things are barely a mm thick, and about the size of a US postage stamp. The darn thing came in a plastic bubble the size of your average magazine!

...That tripped me out, but I found out that they're not the worst offenders. I went to a local discount store, and I swear, a postage-stamp-sized memory card was packaged in a blister pack that was nearly the size of a serving tray! I know they're trying to prevent theft, but come on, now... Couldn't you just imbed an RFID tag inside of a smaller package, or something?

[El_Cu_Guy]

Vendors need large software boxes so they can show you all the "features" and reviews of their software.

Perhaps I need to be a little clearer. The boxes would remain the same (TV Guide sized). The CD case inside the box would change. There really is no need to used CD cases which consist of three parts (the two outside pieces and the inner CD holder). What do they hold besides a disc? A dinky little pullout and a label on the front and back? A smaller sized DVD case (similar in size to a CD case or 2/3 the height of a DVD movie case) would do just as well. They also fit just as well in storage racks. They use thinner lighter yet stronger plastic and are essentially on piece. Take for example Norton Antivirus or something similar. You install it and it sits on a shelf somewhere. Does the CD case need to look all pretty, just sitting there?

There still needs to be space left for song titles and album art.

When I referenced DVD cases I meant the materials. They can hold those little booklets just fine.

The currently used CD cases are a good tradeoff between price and size. Noone wants 100 DVD cases when slimmer CD cases will do. DVD cases take up quite a bit of room.

Again they could be made to be the same size as regular CD cases. I really do understand why DVD movie cases need to be as big as they are other than cover art.

Shouldn't you be able to recycle old CD cases at electronics and music stores in a free and convenient way?

Excellent idea. Kind of like how they used to recycle pop bottle (didn't melt them down just washed them).

Anote on music CDs. I haven't messed with cases in so long it's not even funny. Everything sits on my hard drive and the discs are in binders.

If you're still confused on the type of cases I am referring to I will try to post a pic later.

Alex Cavnar, aka alc6379 --

I notice that everytime I go to Best Buy. I take a gander at the computer section (networking mostly, and I love messing with the sale staff and the guys from Geek "Scrubs") and I notice that some of the smallest stuff usually has the biggest packaging. I recently saw the new cases for the Acoustic Research (AR) cables (AV cables stuff like that). Huge thick plastic eggshell cases. They're cables for crying out loud!

[duncanbojangles]

Ahh, I see now. But if software is going to be sit in a box on a shelf, why bother with a case at all? A paper sleeve should do the trick if it is taped to the inside of the box.

[Parcival]

Well, I think it's all a matter of recycling. When people just buy a product and then throw away the package material everything's a waste, no matter how small it is and what matter it is made of.

Cardboard's great because it's easy to recycle, I'd love to see more software coming in cardboard boxes. However, it's also possible to go for plastic as plastic can be recycled, too, although it's more diffcult to process it. However, we better do recycle it concerning the protection of our remaining oil ressources.

I think the biggest problem are the CDs - I throw away a lot of CDs while I keep the cases to use them later again. It was just recently when I saw in my university's library that they accept CDs for recycling - but besides this spot I have found no place where they'd do that.

[Alex Cavnar, aka alc6379]

I was at my mailbox the other day, and it made me think of this thread:

I reached in, to pull out a "GET 1024 HOURS FREE OF AOLLLLL1!!!!!11!!!" disc that I get about biweekly. Surprisingly, the package was about the most elaborate I've seen so far. It was made out of thin particle board, complete with bevelled edges so everything would fit nicely togetger. Had it've been a little thicker, I would have mistaken it for a cigar humidor!

[El_Cu_Guy]

Got that one and a nice thick plastic one too.

[El_Cu_Guy]

Alright as I had promised before, here are those photos of the cases for reference.

Note: No that is not my computer, desk or office.

[El_Cu_Guy]

Here's another with them open

[DMR]

Mmm- guess my work here is done...

[CoffeeMan]

This is all so true. The reason Mac is so popular is because it looks good, but it doesn't actually do anything. Windows XP is just Windows 2000 with a newer, dumber interface. And a fresh load of new bugs.

[El_Cu_Guy]

Huh?!?

WTF does that have to do with software packaging?

[DMR]

Originally posted by El_Cu_Guy
Huh?!?

WTF does that have to do with software packaging?

My guess is that the post was supposed to end up in another thread.