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Thread: Linux for Dummies?

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by cybertron
    No, but you're probably not a power user until you are comfortable with the command-line. Most people who learn the command-line don't go back to GUI methods for a lot of things.
    I have small hands with quite stubby fingers (my mates rip the piss outta my hands - sods). Using a CLI can be frustating since it's difficult to be accurate when typing for long periods of time. So even though I consider myself quite competent at using a command line. Point and Click is less frustrating.
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  2. #17
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    I am finding as I progress through my Linux journey that I am making more and more use of the CLI, setup of; dual screens, samba, networking, partition management and file backups to name a few. Yay me! However when I actually want to use the computer to do something rather than just configure it then KDE is the one for me.

    Web browsing in the CLI is possible (as I found out during my first gentoo install) but not all that entertaining with all the "art" missing! I want to see my music and pick a song, have the song leap out at me, not list the file names and grep for what I am looking for. Writing is much easier when I can grab paragraphs and just drag them around. I can't imagine using the gimp with out a GUI.

    When doing all of these GUI tasks I also like my eye-candy but I tend to want a clean desktop with no Icons, I like the customisability of KDE not just the few colour options of Gnome.

    In summary

    Usability = KDE
    Customisability = KDE
    Configuration = CLI
    Choice = KDE or Gnome or CLI =Linux.

    Suse and Mepis give me just what I want.

  3. #18
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    Red face

    Quote Originally Posted by cybertron
    No, but you're probably not a power user until you are comfortable with the command-line. Most people who learn the command-line don't go back to GUI methods for a lot of things. For instance, regarding your cp example I do almost all of my file management from the CLI now, with a few exceptions where I'm selecting largely random groups of files or need a visual preview of the file. It's actually a lot faster for me than navigating through layers of folders in a GUI.
    I'll agree with that. Alot of things can be faster through the CLI. Sometimes its just easier for my brain to comprehend pictures

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lucas_Maximus
    I have small hands with quite stubby fingers (my mates rip the piss outta my hands - sods). Using a CLI can be frustating since it's difficult to be accurate when typing for long periods of time. So even though I consider myself quite competent at using a command line. Point and Click is less frustrating.
    Yeah, if you're not comfortable typing that much then that would change things.

    Learning the CLI is not an overnight process either. You don't just wake up one day and decide that you're going to use the CLI for everything you do. I didn't really start using it as much as I do until I started using Gentoo and had to do a lot of stuff with it. Now I use it even on non-Gentoo machines because that's one thing that's consistent between all Linux computers.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lucas_Maximus
    Windows installers work rather well. You download the program you want and it is installed onto computer after a few clicks. The system works well.

    In both cases the user is not astonished that the program has done exactly what it is supposed to do.
    ROFLMAO

    First off, I am ALWAYS astonished when a program on windows does exactly what it's supposed to do!

    Secondly, even with the "idiot proofing" of continuously clicking the same button over and over to install a program, better idiots are built that STILL need to have someone there to tell them to click the next or ok buttons.

    "Astonishment factors" apply to anyone that works in tech support that wonders how some of these people can function day to day with out having someone change their diapers!

    I am not in favour of making things hard for the sake of it, mentality that seems to exist for some users. People should be able to "read the documentation" and be able to use it.

    I also have no sympathy for joe-I cannot be bothered to use google.

    /rant over

    Kind Regards

    Lucas
    With the google thing, if someone doesn't know that the resource is available, how can they be expected to use it?
    Take for example, my children. They are 9 and 11. They don't know how to use search engines yet. I've told them about google, yet, because my ex is being herself, I can't be there to show them, and teach them how to use these resources.
    When my kids become adults, if they haven't learned how to use such a resource, they will be asking about these things as well.
    Knute

    You live, you die, enjoy the interval!

  6. #21
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    I'll even pop my head in on this discussion.

    I agree entirely with Linus on this one. I have quit using Gnome, and I avoid it whenever possible. I don't jump in on Gnome vs. KDE flamewars, or anything, but I disagree at a fundamental level.

    Using KDE as a base of comparison to Gnome, Gnome IS simple. KDE CAN be simple. The difference is that if you want to change a number of common "power user" options in Gnome, you have to edit arcane settings via gconf-editor, if it's even there. Often times, Gnome developers say, "this is the best way", and leave you with no other option BUT the default. In that sense, you're stuck using the UI paradigm that they've set forth for you, whether you entirely like it or not.

    I'll give KDE this much: they may get derided for it, but they make gosh darn EVERYTHING configurable. Thankfully, the default config is pretty usable, but you could really take your time and customize mostly everything in the UI. You could make it simpler, you could make it more advanced, too.

    What do I use for a desktop, normally? Neither Gnome nor KDE. When I need a GUI, I throw Ion on my box. That's the most I really need for day-to-day operation. It might take a change in thought pattern to use it, but it gets the job done for me admirably.
    Registered Linux user #230403! Since March 2001! YAY.

    Try doing a forum search or a google search before asking a question. And please don't use HELP! in the topic of your post... it's so lame... Please don't PM me for help-- post a question in the forum instead.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Cavnar, aka alc6379
    When I need a GUI, I throw Ion on my box.
    Hmm, you are not going to impress the babes with this one, are you?

    "What can be said at all can be said clearly, and what we cannot talk about we must pass over in silence."

    Tractatus Logico-Philosophicus by Ludwig Wittgenstein (1889-1951)

  8. #23
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    Neither will I with twm, but hey, it works for me, and it installs with X (or it did up until X.org 7; I'm not sure about after that), so good enough.

  9. #24
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    Ok if I get in here? I'm not a power user, for sure. I want live CD version that I can get on the internet with, no prob. I did with Xandros, one click, winmodem or not. I'm sick of seeing people I know sticking $1000 or more in a new comp. cause the old one is running like Barry Bonds(not as fast anymore.) I have Puppy and Damn Small Linux, they open something before your finger is off the mouse, of course, they're worthless without a connection. I did say I'm not a power user, right? And I'd like to see it loaded with games, not the ability to interact with a thousand and one networks all at the same time. Nobody I know knows any more than I do about this stuff, or uses it for anything else, either, and I know a lot of people with computers, who doesn't? We just get a new computer every few years. When our old computer slows down to a crawl, it's off to Best Buy with the checkbook. rant over

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by xandros_x
    Ok if I get in here? I'm not a power user, for sure. I want live CD version that I can get on the internet with, no prob. I did with Xandros, one click, winmodem or not. I'm sick of seeing people I know sticking $1000 or more in a new comp. cause the old one is running like Barry Bonds(not as fast anymore.) I have Puppy and Damn Small Linux, they open something before your finger is off the mouse, of course, they're worthless without a connection. I did say I'm not a power user, right? And I'd like to see it loaded with games, not the ability to interact with a thousand and one networks all at the same time. Nobody I know knows any more than I do about this stuff, or uses it for anything else, either, and I know a lot of people with computers, who doesn't? We just get a new computer every few years. When our old computer slows down to a crawl, it's off to Best Buy with the checkbook. rant over

    Hi there, welcome to the forum.

    The topic of this particular discussion isn't actually "Linux for Dummies", as in the title of the book series. What we're discussing is how certain User Interface designers assume that users are literally dummies, and that a plethora of options being available is not really a good idea.

    If you're actually looking for advice on a distribution of Linux that suits your needs, I suggest creating a new thread in the .iso confused-- Which Distro? forum. Your particular query isn't really on-topic for the current discussion.

    Have a great day, and welcome aboard!
    Registered Linux user #230403! Since March 2001! YAY.

    Try doing a forum search or a google search before asking a question. And please don't use HELP! in the topic of your post... it's so lame... Please don't PM me for help-- post a question in the forum instead.

  11. #26
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    I'm not sure he was looking for a distro. It kinda sounds like he's already happily using Xandros and being disgusted with the people who buy computers every couple of years because Windows has slowed down so much.

  12. #27
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    Thanks for the reply. It was just a rant, though. Cybertron got it right. I don't like to see good computers at garage sales and in the landfill. I still want that fast live Linux CD you can get on the net with, with a click.
    Icarus wrote,
    "True, making things for idiots will bring in the idiots...BUT if the idiots communicate with you and let you know what they are having troubles with, you can fix it and make it better. If Linux was only designed to be used by Linux people then only Linux people will use it and wonder why the rest of the world doesn't see things their way. It's a two way street and the BS flows in both directions.

    What developers need to worry about instead of "should this be easy to use or easy to configure" is that they should be asking "IS this easy to use and what should be done to make it better?" We don't need to throw every option possible at people, but we shouldn't hide them all either. People won't change something if they don't know it's there (buried in a .config file somewhere with little to no comments)."

    That's what I was kinda thinking. These live CD's are so close to being perfect it's driving me crazy. I just gotta get on the net with them. Not just me, anybody.
    Last edited by xandros_x; 04-22-2006 at 01:16 AM.

  13. #28
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    im extreemly new to linux and id have to say kde is more functional for me , plain and simple i need to learn alot more about coding to really get the most out of linux, kde desktop has alot of utilitys that i found easy to get used to, aventually i want to game on this system and it looks like kde is using open gl drivers, the grafix are awesome, like the skins for the xmms player , lots of cool desktop backgrounds , advanced file handling , got a server i havent figured out yet , ya''ll plz dont hack it up, mabye some day it will become something worth while for everyone......bye to gamespy, no linux users allowed, im guessing they dont think we know their using it, so why not a patch for us linux users?, and i think id just pop in the cd and use grup to get rebooted ,"option repair a existing installation....." i allways liked hacking up windows 2. like the the firewall, check the service u want to allow other users on the internet to use? is that a trick question. like i dont want to wind up passing around porn unknowingly... 'it could happen" and i dont want to boot up tommorow and see a raid array compiling on my system , 7 partitions poped up on last install, good job hackers but i could used good advice not a hack job, i may be new to linux but not stupid

  14. #29
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    I use Ubuntu. Yes, the install detected all the hardware.

    (How is that a bad thing? Would you guys want book a missing a chapter? Because hey then you could "learn" by writing it. lol After all, if you never have to fix anything on your own how will you learn right? What? You want it to just pick it up and be able to read it? Well, then damn stop reading because i'm a writer, I can write and i'm mad because you'll never need to learn how to!! That doesn't make much sense...)

    But - thanks to people here and the Ubuntu forum - I learned how to edit sources list, and other things. And my best friend is going to run Ubuntu, so now I can help him learn those things also. Those are positive things.

    I am learning more about nix, at my own pace. Maybe someday i'll be a leet guru, maybe I won't. One of the great things about linux is you can start wherever you want. Want an easy place to start try Ubuntu, Memphis, etc. Want a hard place to start, try something more hardcore.

    I don't see why the hardcore guys feel threatened by those who are happy with a machine that works. Those who don't feel the need to program, or tweak everything. I certainly don't feel threaten by those with uber leet linux knowledge.

    Is "Linux For Dummies" a good book? I've never read it, but it probably is out there.
    Currently running Xubuntu & Blag.

    My blog:
    http://truthjournal.blogspot.com

    The Easy Guide to Installing debian:
    http://www.osnews.com/story.php?news_id=2016

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chess007
    Is "Linux For Dummies" a good book? I've never read it, but it probably is out there.
    Yes. It's excellent. The command reference in the front cover is invaluable when you are first learning how to use the command line.
    Knute

    You live, you die, enjoy the interval!

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