After all my complaining, I have embraced Ubuntu

[blackbelt_jones]

Instead of disabling GDM, does it work just as well to reboot, press "esc" when the grub menu appears, and boot into "recovery" mode or whatever they call it? If I remember correctly it presents you with a root prompt to make changes.

That makes sense to me, now that you mention it. Sorry for not thinking about that. By all means, give it a try.

[gamblor01]

Yeah I just tried it and that's exactly what it does...gives you a root prompt. That might be a simpler way to get to a root prompt and fix the display instead of moving all of those files around to disable the GDM. It might also work just as well to press ctrl+alt+F2 and use the prompt there.

Fortunately for me I don't have any resolution problems...so I don't need to do any of that stuff.

[Labman]

Maybe I will get up the guts to try it tomorrow.

[IsaacKuo]

Yeah, yeah, yet another distro hop. I'm shocked! I didn't see that one coming! Hehe.

I'm still using Debian Stable; started on Sarge when it was Testing (thanks to SOMEONE's constant ravings about it, at the time); went to Etch. I have no plans to convert to Lenny until it goes stable.

But I did put Ubuntu onto a laptop I just got. I didn't feel like doing all of my usual customizations on it, I just wanted a simple setup that would provide functionality out-of-box. And it's my first computer with wireless networking, which I know squat about. And I like showing off the wobbly warpy windows of Compiz/Beryl, and didn't feel like the effort of installing it on Etch.

Well, what can I say--I'm pretty happy with Ubuntu on the laptop. I just had to do some obscure manual editing of /boot/grub/menu.lst in order to get the console to be visible and somehow this reduced boot times from ~10 minutes down to a "normal" amount (I think it hangs for several minutes when it can't display the boot splash, and from then on the text console is invisible, leaving no indication that the machine is doing anything until gdm finally appears).

But there's nothing about Ubuntu which would make me switch from Debian Stable for my other workstations. I do NOT like lots of constant updates. That's fine for this laptop which isn't heavily customized and which I can simply reinstall whenever I feel like. But my other systems are tweaked out and customized for diskless net-booting and all sorts of fun stuff.

[gamblor01]

This is somewhat off topic, but...hey blackbelt -- where did you find the hard drive icon in your screen shot? My Fedora system uses that icon and I really like it, but I can't seem to figure out where it's at so that I can use it on my Ubuntu system. I have looked all over /usr/share/icons but haven't found it so far. Think you can tell me where to look?

Also...Dexter is a great show. We bought the season 1 DVDs. I'm looking forward to Season 2!

[gamblor01]

Nevermind...I found the icon under /usr/share/icons/gnome/scalable. Now I'm quite happy with my Ubuntu partition. In fact, I'm so happy with it that I repartitioned to double it's size (as I have a feeling I'm going to be using it much more often), and reinstalled.

Anyway, I just got The Orange Box installed via wine and configured it so that it's perfectly playable. Oddly enough, it doesn't run as nice as my Windows box (i.e. frame rate) once the game is loaded, but it loads the games considerably faster than Windows does. I guess I'll go write up a how to because there were some options that would've been nice to see in one big how-to.

[blackbelt_jones]

Yeah, yeah, yet another distro hop. I'm shocked! I didn't see that one coming! Hehe.

I'm still using Debian Stable; started on Sarge when it was Testing (thanks to SOMEONE's constant ravings about it, at the time); went to Etch. I have no plans to convert to Lenny until it goes stable.

But I did put Ubuntu onto a laptop I just got. I didn't feel like doing all of my usual customizations on it, I just wanted a simple setup that would provide functionality out-of-box. And it's my first computer with wireless networking, which I know squat about. And I like showing off the wobbly warpy windows of Compiz/Beryl, and didn't feel like the effort of installing it on Etch.

Well, what can I say--I'm pretty happy with Ubuntu on the laptop. I just had to do some obscure manual editing of /boot/grub/menu.lst in order to get the console to be visible and somehow this reduced boot times from ~10 minutes down to a "normal" amount (I think it hangs for several minutes when it can't display the boot splash, and from then on the text console is invisible, leaving no indication that the machine is doing anything until gdm finally appears).

But there's nothing about Ubuntu which would make me switch from Debian Stable for my other workstations. I do NOT like lots of constant updates. That's fine for this laptop which isn't heavily customized and which I can simply reinstall whenever I feel like. But my other systems are tweaked out and customized for diskless net-booting and all sorts of fun stuff.

By the way, I think my reputation for distro-hopping is greatly exaggerated. I like to try stuff out, but since I fell in love with Debian Sarge four years ago (when it was testing), I've switched maybe once a year... from Debian to SUSE, back to Debain, and now to Ubuntu.

I think you and I may be pretty much on the same page. I'm a hobbyist, my computer is mostly about entertainment and education. If I had any servers or any serious mission-critical computers, I'd probably stick with Etch. I do like to get a look at what's new, but Sid is problematic for me. I keep breaking it. Maybe when I know more about administration. God help me, I believe I'm no longer the dumbest person in here... but I'm still a slow learner.

The truth is, ever since I started using Debian, I've been a Debian man. I only stopped using Debian and started using SUSE because there were things I didn't know how to with Debian, and when I learned them, I returned. And you can expect me to stay within the Debian family for a long, long time. So much software, so easy to get! It may be called Ubuntu, Kanotix, Mepis, Lenny, or Sid... but it will always be Debian to me.

[blackbelt_jones]

This is somewhat off topic, but...hey blackbelt -- where did you find the hard drive icon in your screen shot? My Fedora system uses that icon and I really like it, but I can't seem to figure out where it's at so that I can use it on my Ubuntu system. I have looked all over /usr/share/icons but haven't found it so far. Think you can tell me where to look?

Also...Dexter is a great show. We bought the season 1 DVDs. I'm looking forward to Season 2!

It is a rather nice looking icon. I just appeared there. If you're getting something else, you can try playiing with themes, or if you really want it that bad, maybe try the find command:

oscar@ubuntcake:~$ cd /
oscar@ubuntcake:/$ sudo find -name *.ico -print
oscar@ubuntcake:/$ sudo find -name *.png -print

I'll look for it myself when I get the chance, but this is a pretty horrific hectic weekend for me.

[blackbelt_jones]

Nevermind...I found the icon under /usr/share/icons/gnome/scalable.

D'oh!

[IsaacKuo]

By the way, I think my reputation for distro-hopping is greatly exaggerated. I like to try stuff out, but since I fell in love with Debian Sarge four years ago (when it was testing), I've switched maybe once a year... from Debian to SUSE, back to Debain, and now to Ubuntu.

Yes, but I guess it's the way you switch that's amusing to us. Anyway, switching once a year is pretty often. Most of us are simply too lazy to switch that often, even if we wanted to.

[blackbelt_jones]

Well, it's like Oscar WIlde said, the only think worse than being talked about is not being talked about.

I don't blame anyone for being amused and entertained by my distro adventures... that's one reason why I like to share them. But when I look back over it all, if you count Kanotix as a Debian, and Mepis as a Debian, and Ubuntu as a Debian, I've mostly been about Debian. Debian is number 1.


I have a number 2, and that's Slackware. I have a really slow machine, and I'm running Vector Linux on that, because certain essential applications keep crashing on Debian. Slackware is a great taking-care-of-business disto for me. For some reason, when I use Slackware, I become very productive. Someday, I'd like to install Slackware on an old laptop, and use it just for writing.

I no longer have any personal interest in SUSE, but it was a great newbie distro for me, and I'll bet it makes a great choice for business, because everyone in the organization can run it. YAST makes administration super accessable. I still admire SUSE, but it's not for me.

Maybe the point is that I have learned something from my wanderings, and these days I have less and less urge to wander. I used to check out every Fedora release, but I stopped after FC5. Mandriva? I don't think so.

[mrrangerman43]

IsaacKuo

Well, what can I say--I'm pretty happy with Ubuntu on the laptop. I just had to do some obscure manual editing of /boot/grub/menu.lst in order to get the console to be visible and somehow this reduced boot times from ~10 minutes down to a "normal" amount (I think it hangs for several minutes when it can't display the boot splash, and from then on the text console is invisible, leaving no indication that the machine is doing anything until gdm finally appears).

I have a system that did the same thing, can you post what you did to correct it?

Maybe just post that part of your menu.lst

thanks
Dan

[IsaacKuo]

I don't remember exactly, but I think I removed the "quiet" and "bootsplash" options from the relevant boot line in /boot/grub/menu.lst.

[IsaacKuo]

But when I look back over it all, if you count Kanotix as a Debian, and Mepis as a Debian, and Ubuntu as a Debian,

I don't. Sure, they use the same package management system and are largely compatable with each other. But when it comes right down to it, they all have their own quirks so when you install a new one you've got to figure out all the annoying things they do differently (for example, everyone seems to have different ideas of what ought to be the default status of ssh and su/sudo). Most of us are too lazy to go through the effort.

[blackbelt_jones]

I don't. Sure, they use the same package management system and are largely compatable with each other. But when it comes right down to it, they all have their own quirks so when you install a new one you've got to figure out all the annoying things they do differently (for example, everyone seems to have different ideas of what ought to be the default status of ssh and su/sudo). Most of us are too lazy to go through the effort.

Well, this is all semantics. I really think that you and I see eye to eye on the nuts and bolts of this stuff as much as anyone in here. After all, you like Ubuntu, too, on your laptop.

In my experience, Sid and Etch each have their own distinctive and annoying quirks, and they're both Debian. And Kanotix and Sidux are both conscious attempts to put Debian on a live CD with a capability for a good solid hard drive install, the same product in a different package.

And, lord knows, I have gone on and on in here like an old man yelling at kids to get off his lawn, kvetching about the annoying little quirks of Ubuntu. I've contacted the developers about this, about this, and someday, I hope they make those few changes that will make Ubuntu more approachable to Debian users, but it's not hard to see why the Windows users have been the first priority. The problem with Ubuntu is that it looks and feels so much like Debain, that a Debian user will be led astray. Frankly, I can't remember what they were at this time, but like I saidI have written about this before.

But the point of this thread is that overcoming these annoyances has been worthwhile for me. Ubuntu is working out for me, and as a Debian fan, it pleases me that the first real desktop breakout distro superstar is Debian-based. The fact that Debian has been the father of such important innovations (consider Knoppix!) while staying true to free software principles is a big reason why it is the greatest distro ever.

Someday, if keep getting better at this, I may start using SID... but right now, upgrading SID keeps getting me into trouble, and after almost six years, and a number of installs that I could only guess at (but if i could tell you, you would know that I am crazy), I don't want to reinstall my system any more than I have to. Ubuntu may better suited to my current wants, needs, and abilities, but Debian GNU/Linux (the only major distro I know with the integrity to put the "GNU" right there in its official name) has always been King, as far as I'm concerned, and always will be.